Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

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Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby LordObsidious » Wed Oct 24, 2018 3:56 pm

Signal Flow:

ESP LTD F-404FM Tribal w/ EMG 81s OR Schecter C1 Blackjack w/ Petrucci Dimarzio pickups> Livewire Elite 18 Gauge cable > Countryman Type 85 FET DI Box > Mogami Gold XLR > Behringer XAIR18 Mic input w/ Phanton Power > Reaper > Amplitube > Yamaha HS8s/Sennheiser 650HD Headphones

I also have a Scarlett 2i2 that i've tried, same problem.

My guitars/basses have fresh strings and batteries and I change them pretty often.

Now I'm a tone slob, but not that much of one. I wasn't expecting Amplitube to sound even 80% like a real amp but...

I have been experimenting with Amplitube for a bit now for high gain metal tones as Im no longer able to mic up a real cabinet and it seems like every amp/cab/mic combination I've tried has suffered from either sounding like there is a pillow between the mic and the speaker or it's 100% treble with zero bass or mids. The ENGL stuff (my go to in real life is a ENGL Powerball through a ENGL Pro 4x12) sounds almost nothing like a real ENGL, the cabs are very very tinny and makes me feel like I'm in an airplane and need to pop my ears.

Here is my typical "go to" start point configuration for amplifiers:

Clean boost (zero drive, 8 level, 5-7 tone [depends on the amp]) Tube Screamer
AMP:
Gain: ~3-4, depends on the amp. I tend to play on the lower end of the usable gain spectrum.
Lows: 5
Mids: 7
Treble: 6

I usually follow this up with an EQ after the plugin ~80hz HPF and ~8-11k hz (again depending on the amp) LPF. If there's an annoying whistle i narrow Q it out by about -3 to -4 DB.

As for gain staging I've tried two different approaches

1) Setting the gain on the interface to just below clipping at my strongest strum/palm mutes. This gives me peaks of -6 to -3 dBFS in my DAW. Hits the input of Amplitube super hard w/o clipping.

2) Setting the gain on the interface to get me around -12 to -9 peak, or roughly 0 on a VU meter calibrated to -18 at my strongest strum/palm mute and boosting the input of amplitube itself by about 7-8 db to give me a good "yellow" signal.

I then check the mics to make sure they aren't clipping and adjust the final output knob to the "yellow/orange" zone and verify there is zero clipping at any point in the program. On amps (such as the 5150 clone) that have a meter on the amp, I keep it safely below the red.

I've tried various amp/cab combinations and have adjusted the microphones in the cab section exactly how I would in real life. Usually winding up with a 57 mic on the edge of the dustcap and backed off slightly to taste for bass control. Probably the most common mic placement setup in the world of metal.

Can you explain to me what I'm doing wrong? For me amplitube sounds nothing like what I heard through many videos online (A lot of these claim no processing was done outside of appropriate LPF/HPF), even with people playing guitars that have EMG 81s active / Dimarzio passive pickups. I've also been comparing amp/cab/mic combos of real life amps to amplitube and they sound almost nothing alike so there has to be some user error here. For example the 5150 into a Mesa 2x12 mic'd with a 57 in amplitube sounds almost nothing like the real thing when listening to just the guitars in ISO, sounds just as fizzy but tonally no where close. I've heard usable metal tones come out of this thing, what's the deal?

A lot of people have recommended simply bypassing the cab section because "the cab IRs in amplitube are very bad" and using IRs but the interactions in the cab room is like 80% of the reason I bought this software.
LordObsidious
 
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby Ryan_IK » Wed Oct 24, 2018 5:31 pm

Hello LordObsidious,

Thanks for your post!

We are sorry to hear of your troubles, and while we do appreciate all of the information laid out here. Please do note, this is a user-to-user discussion forum. We strongly suggest checking with our technical support team to see what could be going on here. They are they best persons to reach out to with any kinds of issues.

Note - If you have already reached out, send me the Ticket # you received in a PM.

Make sure to send them all of the information listed out here as well as some recording examples of what you are hearing. They should be able to help you figure out what is going on here.

https://www.ikmultimedia.com/contact-support/
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby LordObsidious » Wed Oct 24, 2018 5:39 pm

Ryan,

I did send a Tech Support email with this exact information (i copy pasted it here) just figured i'd try to reach out to the user base as well. As for examples, here is a song I recently tracked with a band using amplitube (removed the vocals and processing for better judgement so this is just a volume mix) The only thing present here are LP filters to control the low end and a HPF on the guitars. The drums are Perfect Drums, which are already pretty processed out of the VST.

The set up (i used the second example I gave of gain staging for this)

Overscream (0 drive, ~7 level, 5 tone)

Mesa Mark IV Lead channel, graphic EQ disabled.
Gain ~6 (more than I would typically use but i felt it needed the saturation)
Lows: 5
Mids: 7
Treble: 6

Orange 4x12 w/ 57 on the edge of the DC.

We (the guitarist and I) chose this set up because nothing else even sounded remotely usable with his guitar (it also had EMG 81s) and we tried for hours.

Input and Output knobs adjusted to tickle yellow.

https://soundcloud.com/when-metal-meets ... f-violence

I also had several examples of just dual tracked guitars running through various setups but I removed it, I can reupload it when I get home.
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby Ryan_IK » Wed Oct 24, 2018 5:59 pm

Thanks for your reply.

We appreciate the info and the track. From what I can hear, this tone sounds very heavy, but it it a bit hard to pick out any issues hearing it in the mix. From what you're saying, it sounds like you are figuring out different ways to set up your tone. Keep in mind each guitar and audio interface will react different to audio signal and may present different results. I would suggest both working with the team to make sure there is nothing going wrong in your software and checking out some video demos on settings up some heavier tones. Seeing what other users do to get good tone should help get you some ideas. I've thrown some links below which may help here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtPIl6kgB60&vl=en-US

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48SN0I49EjU

Below is a tutorial on recording guitar in general with Misha Mansoor. While this does not use AmpliTube, this is a great video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=er9VhozNHNk
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby LordObsidious » Wed Oct 24, 2018 6:05 pm

I've seen Olas and Mishas videos before in the past, and it was actually Olas video on the mesa pack that made me want Amplitube in the first place as I'm personally a big fan of the MK IV. Unfortunately I can't get anywhere near his results with the program and Misha spends half of that video addressing clipping, which is indeed a huge problem for novices but I'm using, what I assume is, proper gain staging for Amplitube.
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby LordObsidious » Sat Oct 27, 2018 10:20 pm

Follow Up:

It appears my ticket I submitted 3 days ago to support was ignored and deleted as it no longer exists.

Ticket #857723

Killer customer service. A+
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby Ryan_IK » Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:28 pm

LordObsidious wrote:Follow Up:

It appears my ticket I submitted 3 days ago to support was ignored and deleted as it no longer exists.

Ticket #857723

Killer customer service. A+

I am looking at the system now and this ticket in no way has been deleted. Please be patient while the team gets back to you.
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby LordObsidious » Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:11 pm

It's possible the site is just messed up then, as it gives me an error when inputting my email and ticket number in to check the status.

Either way I have re-downloaded and re-installed the software to see if that corrects the problem, as I'm sure that will be what they recommend.
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby Ryan_IK » Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:17 pm

LordObsidious wrote:It's possible the site is just messed up then, as it gives me an error when inputting my email and ticket number in to check the status.

Either way I have re-downloaded and re-installed the software to see if that corrects the problem, as I'm sure that will be what they recommend.

It's unclear what issue you are experiencing when trying to get to your ticket. Please PM some more information on your issues and I can relay these to the support team.
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby lucaspaul1974 » Sun Jul 31, 2022 12:12 am

OKAY,THIS FIXED MY PROBLEM,I WAS USING FOCUSRITE 2ND GENERATION,I UPGRADED TO 3RD GENERATION AND EVERYTHING IS AS IT SHOULD BE CRYSTAL CLEAR!!!THE 2ND GEN PREAMPS ARE NOT CUTTING IT. :D
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Re: Everything sounds muffled and/or overly harsh?

Postby hectorsm3 » Wed Nov 01, 2023 1:41 pm

I have 3rd gen Scarlett Solo and still have this same problem. I've been dealing with support for more than 2 months but it's completly useless, it seems every email is answered by a different person.
After 2 months and more than 30 emails I still have to explain what the issue is, they keep mixing it with outher issues that have nothing to do with my problem.

They've also said more than once that they have never heard of anyone having this problem or something similar.

Out of frustation I asked for a refund but of course they also denied me that claiming my samples which sound clearly harsh and muddy sound good enough for them even though I strated contacting support about this the very next day I bought the AT5.
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